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	<title>Comments on: RadFA</title>
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	<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 21:05:58 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: BStu</title>
		<link>http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/2008/05/09/radfa/#comment-453</link>
		<dc:creator>BStu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 May 2008 22:09:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/?p=74#comment-453</guid>
		<description>Look, there was no need for Big Liberty to do any "detective work". That I'll agree with. You've repeatedly and publicly identified yourself as someone who is trying to lose weight, including posting a "weight loss blog" with your starting and current weight regularly updated. Which you link to from your bio on your site, as well as linking to a book you contributed to which promotes itself as a weight loss blog anthology. I believe it said "Seven Women. One Goal. 350 pounds to go". And I hear you just did a fawning interview with a diet blogger about how awesome weight loss is and how stupid fat acceptance is, so there's that, too. Definitely no secret, you are absolutely right about that.

Not sure I'd get "weight loss" never being the goal from the self-described "weight loss" blog, though. What with the constant talking about how much weight you wanted to lose and how much you had lost. I guess maybe that you were keeping a secret. Good job, though. One never would have guessed when reading about how much you were trying to lose that you weren't trying to lose weight.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Look, there was no need for Big Liberty to do any &#8220;detective work&#8221;. That I&#8217;ll agree with. You&#8217;ve repeatedly and publicly identified yourself as someone who is trying to lose weight, including posting a &#8220;weight loss blog&#8221; with your starting and current weight regularly updated. Which you link to from your bio on your site, as well as linking to a book you contributed to which promotes itself as a weight loss blog anthology. I believe it said &#8220;Seven Women. One Goal. 350 pounds to go&#8221;. And I hear you just did a fawning interview with a diet blogger about how awesome weight loss is and how stupid fat acceptance is, so there&#8217;s that, too. Definitely no secret, you are absolutely right about that.</p>
<p>Not sure I&#8217;d get &#8220;weight loss&#8221; never being the goal from the self-described &#8220;weight loss&#8221; blog, though. What with the constant talking about how much weight you wanted to lose and how much you had lost. I guess maybe that you were keeping a secret. Good job, though. One never would have guessed when reading about how much you were trying to lose that you weren&#8217;t trying to lose weight.</p>
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		<title>By: mo pie</title>
		<link>http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/2008/05/09/radfa/#comment-434</link>
		<dc:creator>mo pie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 May 2008 17:16:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/?p=74#comment-434</guid>
		<description>Big Liberty, I also wrote about using FitDay &lt;a href="http://www.bfdblog.com/2008/03/13/the-fitday-experiment/" rel="nofollow"&gt;right here&lt;/a&gt; on BFD. I don't see how tracking my food is a diet, but I certainly wasn't trying to keep it a secret! Since I have a history of disordered eatig, I try to eat as healthfully as I can---get my fruits and veggies in, eat a balanced diet and so forth. The goal has never been "weight loss" but I don't expect you to believe me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Big Liberty, I also wrote about using FitDay <a href="http://www.bfdblog.com/2008/03/13/the-fitday-experiment/" rel="nofollow">right here</a> on BFD. I don&#8217;t see how tracking my food is a diet, but I certainly wasn&#8217;t trying to keep it a secret! Since I have a history of disordered eatig, I try to eat as healthfully as I can&#8212;get my fruits and veggies in, eat a balanced diet and so forth. The goal has never been &#8220;weight loss&#8221; but I don&#8217;t expect you to believe me.</p>
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		<title>By: anniemcphee</title>
		<link>http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/2008/05/09/radfa/#comment-424</link>
		<dc:creator>anniemcphee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 21:31:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/?p=74#comment-424</guid>
		<description>Ohhh.  Yikes!  For whatever it's worth I do know it's possible to be on different sides of that issue and be able to have a civilized conversation about it, and both come out examining new perspectives on it.   I know because I have friends who I've been able to discuss it with exactly like that.  That presumes that both people are going to be respectful, use the terms to refer to one another that they choose (pro-choice/pro-life, etc. rather than pro-death/anti-woman or whateve) and...well it's involved.  It can happen though.  

Comments like that are, IMO, supposed to conjure up the immediate image of full-quiver families standing outside clinics holding up jars full of bloody fetuses, lobbing baby dolls full of red corn syrup at the walls, holding up heinous signs and screaming terrible things after the women going in.  Which certainly happens, but I think it's a terrible blight on the pro-lifers to keep condoning such things.   

What a FA person who feels the fatosphere should not be pimping diet books and diets has in common with people who hold up bloody picket signs, I can't say.   Nothing, I would think.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ohhh.  Yikes!  For whatever it&#8217;s worth I do know it&#8217;s possible to be on different sides of that issue and be able to have a civilized conversation about it, and both come out examining new perspectives on it.   I know because I have friends who I&#8217;ve been able to discuss it with exactly like that.  That presumes that both people are going to be respectful, use the terms to refer to one another that they choose (pro-choice/pro-life, etc. rather than pro-death/anti-woman or whateve) and&#8230;well it&#8217;s involved.  It can happen though.  </p>
<p>Comments like that are, IMO, supposed to conjure up the immediate image of full-quiver families standing outside clinics holding up jars full of bloody fetuses, lobbing baby dolls full of red corn syrup at the walls, holding up heinous signs and screaming terrible things after the women going in.  Which certainly happens, but I think it&#8217;s a terrible blight on the pro-lifers to keep condoning such things.   </p>
<p>What a FA person who feels the fatosphere should not be pimping diet books and diets has in common with people who hold up bloody picket signs, I can&#8217;t say.   Nothing, I would think.</p>
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		<title>By: Caitlin</title>
		<link>http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/2008/05/09/radfa/#comment-423</link>
		<dc:creator>Caitlin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 17:58:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/?p=74#comment-423</guid>
		<description>Oh no, WYW, I didn't mean that. I just somehow missed it at the time and came across it yesterday.

It's in the comments &lt;a href="http://babble.sneakykitty.com/index.php/2008/05/08/re-evaluating-my-thoughts-the-d-word/#comments" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;. (Or at least, I presume that's what you're talking about. Maybe it's happened more than once.)

I'm not going to get into it there, because in my experience abortion rights is the one argument where people get very very polarised very very quickly and no good can come of it. Which is one reason people could be a bit more CAREFUL about the accusations they're thoughtlessly slinging around. But sure, if you just politely &lt;i&gt;hint&lt;/i&gt; that perhaps people should stop talking now, or conduct an discussion among adults exactly the way &lt;i&gt;you'd&lt;/i&gt; like them to (because otherwise they wouldn't know how), or that maybe they sympathise with people who want to deny a woman her reproductive rights (when you clearly don't believe they do) -- well, you're just politely hinting. What's the harm in that?

/no patience for that shit at all</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh no, WYW, I didn&#8217;t mean that. I just somehow missed it at the time and came across it yesterday.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s in the comments <a href="http://babble.sneakykitty.com/index.php/2008/05/08/re-evaluating-my-thoughts-the-d-word/#comments" rel="nofollow">here</a>. (Or at least, I presume that&#8217;s what you&#8217;re talking about. Maybe it&#8217;s happened more than once.)</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not going to get into it there, because in my experience abortion rights is the one argument where people get very very polarised very very quickly and no good can come of it. Which is one reason people could be a bit more CAREFUL about the accusations they&#8217;re thoughtlessly slinging around. But sure, if you just politely <i>hint</i> that perhaps people should stop talking now, or conduct an discussion among adults exactly the way <i>you&#8217;d</i> like them to (because otherwise they wouldn&#8217;t know how), or that maybe they sympathise with people who want to deny a woman her reproductive rights (when you clearly don&#8217;t believe they do) &#8212; well, you&#8217;re just politely hinting. What&#8217;s the harm in that?</p>
<p>/no patience for that shit at all</p>
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		<title>By: AnnieMcPhee</title>
		<link>http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/2008/05/09/radfa/#comment-421</link>
		<dc:creator>AnnieMcPhee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 01:02:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/?p=74#comment-421</guid>
		<description>I saw it too, but don't remember where; I thought it was on that thread.  So...where was it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I saw it too, but don&#8217;t remember where; I thought it was on that thread.  So&#8230;where was it?</p>
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		<title>By: worthyourweight</title>
		<link>http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/2008/05/09/radfa/#comment-420</link>
		<dc:creator>worthyourweight</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 00:06:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/?p=74#comment-420</guid>
		<description>Sorry for the vagueness, Caitlin. I honestly couldn't remember where I saw it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry for the vagueness, Caitlin. I honestly couldn&#8217;t remember where I saw it.</p>
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		<title>By: Caitlin</title>
		<link>http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/2008/05/09/radfa/#comment-419</link>
		<dc:creator>Caitlin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 23:12:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/?p=74#comment-419</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;And for a commenter on another blog to insinuate anti-diet-ers (as in against diets) are closet pro-lifers is just SO GROSS.&lt;/i&gt;

I just now saw what you're talking about.

I...cannot even post about that, because the comparison makes me so angry I can't form coherent thoughts that aren't in capslock. And that, for me, is a lot of angry.

&lt;i&gt;*seethe*&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>And for a commenter on another blog to insinuate anti-diet-ers (as in against diets) are closet pro-lifers is just SO GROSS.</i></p>
<p>I just now saw what you&#8217;re talking about.</p>
<p>I&#8230;cannot even post about that, because the comparison makes me so angry I can&#8217;t form coherent thoughts that aren&#8217;t in capslock. And that, for me, is a lot of angry.</p>
<p><i>*seethe*</i></p>
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		<title>By: worthyourweight</title>
		<link>http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/2008/05/09/radfa/#comment-418</link>
		<dc:creator>worthyourweight</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 02:00:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/?p=74#comment-418</guid>
		<description>"WYW you’ve created the hub of the discussion here - hehe, that’s totally awesome."

And I give you and all the commenters here the credit :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;WYW you’ve created the hub of the discussion here - hehe, that’s totally awesome.&#8221;</p>
<p>And I give you and all the commenters here the credit <img src='http://s.wordpress.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: AnnieMcPhee</title>
		<link>http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/2008/05/09/radfa/#comment-417</link>
		<dc:creator>AnnieMcPhee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 01:01:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/?p=74#comment-417</guid>
		<description>"I hear what’s being said above. I’m sorry for even bringing Sarah up — I just didn’t anticipate the level of viciousness that would ensue. So on the off chance she’s reading this: Sarah, I apologise."

Neither did I, and so do I.  I hadn't seen that she'd been mentioned before I mentioned her, but that just...well, where the rest of it didn't actually *hurt* me (just stunned and mad and shocked) the shit about her hurt.   And I don't ever want to lose her, because she is a TRUE inspiration to me - I'm not very mobile, but just *knowing* that mobility is possible, and that I can do *something*; well, that's flat-out priceless.  To lose someone who is an athlete to a degree I could never have been, but inspires me to want to be all I CAN be, would be tragic.  The woman wasn't even involved, yet gets invoked and then trashed.  Absolutely disgusting.   If there was anything at all unforgivable, it was that.   Though I haven't seen any pronouncements about that fact going on - like hey, she isn't even commenting, can we not trash her?  Gah.   

I'm glad hahafatpants has become a phrase lol.  But it's so true isn't it?  How many times have we seen that?  Worthyourweight inspired that one totally.  It just sums up a whole genre.

BStu I'm still digesting what you just said about finding it a surprise, but you are probably right.  Though I didn't expect to hear FA be called "extreme" in an interview by someone who is presumably into acceptance and I doubt I'll get used to that one.  Dieting stuff, yeah - I mean one of the first (not the first) sites I went to when I discovered FA was elasticwaistband, but I'd been well inoculated by then by the "radicals" against pro-diet talk (and had abandoned diets myself so long ago) so I just dismissed it and moved on.   

It's still disturbing to me that I could have been drawn in, in the course of *fighting* something like that, to think "Well...maybe I could too."  FFS! (It was like on the fifth time I read through it that that crossed my mind.)  What that shit could do to someone on the verge...well I don't know for sure.   I guess I would hope people would keep reading like I did and move past it, because they have, like all of us, a functioning brain.  But triggers apparently run deep, and I wouldn't want to see anyone delayed in the process of self-acceptance and demanding their rights because of something like that. 

Well, as BL and I and others have pointed out, the movement is growing beyond its old bounds, and that's a great thing.  There are a lot of things we can move past to get there - including political differences.  As people come in all shapes and sizes, fat people come in all kinds of political and religious stripes, and I believe that coexistence is not only possible or preferable, but should be seen as inevitable.   Peeples is peeples (as the Muppet Movie taught me.)  And we're fat people.  Different people.  

WYW you've created the hub of the discussion here - hehe, that's totally awesome.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I hear what’s being said above. I’m sorry for even bringing Sarah up — I just didn’t anticipate the level of viciousness that would ensue. So on the off chance she’s reading this: Sarah, I apologise.&#8221;</p>
<p>Neither did I, and so do I.  I hadn&#8217;t seen that she&#8217;d been mentioned before I mentioned her, but that just&#8230;well, where the rest of it didn&#8217;t actually *hurt* me (just stunned and mad and shocked) the shit about her hurt.   And I don&#8217;t ever want to lose her, because she is a TRUE inspiration to me - I&#8217;m not very mobile, but just *knowing* that mobility is possible, and that I can do *something*; well, that&#8217;s flat-out priceless.  To lose someone who is an athlete to a degree I could never have been, but inspires me to want to be all I CAN be, would be tragic.  The woman wasn&#8217;t even involved, yet gets invoked and then trashed.  Absolutely disgusting.   If there was anything at all unforgivable, it was that.   Though I haven&#8217;t seen any pronouncements about that fact going on - like hey, she isn&#8217;t even commenting, can we not trash her?  Gah.   </p>
<p>I&#8217;m glad hahafatpants has become a phrase lol.  But it&#8217;s so true isn&#8217;t it?  How many times have we seen that?  Worthyourweight inspired that one totally.  It just sums up a whole genre.</p>
<p>BStu I&#8217;m still digesting what you just said about finding it a surprise, but you are probably right.  Though I didn&#8217;t expect to hear FA be called &#8220;extreme&#8221; in an interview by someone who is presumably into acceptance and I doubt I&#8217;ll get used to that one.  Dieting stuff, yeah - I mean one of the first (not the first) sites I went to when I discovered FA was elasticwaistband, but I&#8217;d been well inoculated by then by the &#8220;radicals&#8221; against pro-diet talk (and had abandoned diets myself so long ago) so I just dismissed it and moved on.   </p>
<p>It&#8217;s still disturbing to me that I could have been drawn in, in the course of *fighting* something like that, to think &#8220;Well&#8230;maybe I could too.&#8221;  FFS! (It was like on the fifth time I read through it that that crossed my mind.)  What that shit could do to someone on the verge&#8230;well I don&#8217;t know for sure.   I guess I would hope people would keep reading like I did and move past it, because they have, like all of us, a functioning brain.  But triggers apparently run deep, and I wouldn&#8217;t want to see anyone delayed in the process of self-acceptance and demanding their rights because of something like that. </p>
<p>Well, as BL and I and others have pointed out, the movement is growing beyond its old bounds, and that&#8217;s a great thing.  There are a lot of things we can move past to get there - including political differences.  As people come in all shapes and sizes, fat people come in all kinds of political and religious stripes, and I believe that coexistence is not only possible or preferable, but should be seen as inevitable.   Peeples is peeples (as the Muppet Movie taught me.)  And we&#8217;re fat people.  Different people.  </p>
<p>WYW you&#8217;ve created the hub of the discussion here - hehe, that&#8217;s totally awesome.</p>
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		<title>By: BStu</title>
		<link>http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/2008/05/09/radfa/#comment-415</link>
		<dc:creator>BStu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 May 2008 19:21:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://worthyourweight.wordpress.com/?p=74#comment-415</guid>
		<description>Annie, you and others were completely not out of line in that thread. There was actually something else I said at my blog this week where I was being critical of radical fat activists habit of letting themselves get into personal attacks on dieters. I was noting that even not doing that, fat activists were prone to being accused of personal attacks. Frankly, that comment thread is the perfect example of it. What that serves is to shield one political view from criticism by constantly personalizing it and then aggressively defending that personalization. But FA needs to push back on that.

The only thing I'd disagree with is finding any of that initial discussion a surprise at the site in question. It is and has always been a diet blog. This isn't the first time its glorified dieting on the fatosphere feed, either. But I'm very glad people are really taking a critical eye to that and questioning it. Especially this time where to post was a full-on broadside against Fat Acceptance. That needs to be questioned, and I don't think anyone who did so was out of line all though a lot of the people talking you do very much were out of line.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Annie, you and others were completely not out of line in that thread. There was actually something else I said at my blog this week where I was being critical of radical fat activists habit of letting themselves get into personal attacks on dieters. I was noting that even not doing that, fat activists were prone to being accused of personal attacks. Frankly, that comment thread is the perfect example of it. What that serves is to shield one political view from criticism by constantly personalizing it and then aggressively defending that personalization. But FA needs to push back on that.</p>
<p>The only thing I&#8217;d disagree with is finding any of that initial discussion a surprise at the site in question. It is and has always been a diet blog. This isn&#8217;t the first time its glorified dieting on the fatosphere feed, either. But I&#8217;m very glad people are really taking a critical eye to that and questioning it. Especially this time where to post was a full-on broadside against Fat Acceptance. That needs to be questioned, and I don&#8217;t think anyone who did so was out of line all though a lot of the people talking you do very much were out of line.</p>
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